E010 Michael Herman Mental Illness Self-stigma 2

Let’s Be Well Together Podcast - Episode 10

Date: April 5, 2022

Participants: John Webster, Sammy Damaren, Cameron Earnshaw and Sheila Webster
Guest: Michael Herman

Start times and Segments:

[0:00:19] What’s On Your Mind: John and Sammy explore concepts like “Nirvana” and work-life balance, and how John’s approach touches on these concepts.

[0:10:53] Expanding Minds Interview: [Mental Wellness] Part 2 of our interview of lawyer Michael Herman, who talks more specifically about facing self-stigma while addressing mental illness.

[0:33:55] Adventures of the Starving Artist: Cameron tells us about a method to spark innovation and creating freely.

[0:40:00] Move That Body: John came across an article in Runner’s World Magazine that had four simple rules for eating healthy.

[0:46:14] Running Popup: John hopes he falls into the second group.

[0:47:18] Flipside of the Coin: Sheila leads a discussion about it not being selfish to take care of oneself.

Quotes and Take-Aways:

John – What we’re trying to do [with his approach to overall wellness] is trying to figure out how to achieve balance, not in the sense of getting somewhere and being there, but in a moment. Understanding that balance in this moment will look different than it will next week.

Michael – I look at stigma as a societal disapproval that often comes with negative stereotypes. For depression, as an example, a person is lazy and unreliable. For anxiety, a person is fearful, afraid, not strong. These negative stereotypes form. Then there are behaviours that follow from those negative stereotypes that discriminate against those people.

Michael – There’s one definition of stigma as a mark of disgrace associated with a particular circumstance, quality or person. Think about that for a minute: depression or any other form of mental illness being considered a mark of disgrace.

Michael – What happens with stigma, not only does it affect society’s view of people with mental health issues – I didn’t see myself as a person who stigmatizes people with mental illness, but when it came to me, I bought into stigma hook line and sinker. That self-stigma is buying into the negative stereotypes and internalizing them. I started to feel very isolated. My self-stigma led to shame. We don’t think we deserve help.

Michael – Much of the work I had to do to get better and much of the motivation that I had to find to think I was entitled to get better meant I had to confront that self-stigma. I had to work to confront the stereotypes I had bought into. That was one of the most difficult issues I had to deal with for myself.

Michael – Part of the reason why as a society we need to come to terms with and eliminate stigma is in order to make sure that people who are having medical issues don’t start to feel that self-stigma, which is going to shut them down. It’s going to prevent them from seeking the help and doing the things they need to do for themselves to get the help and start to get better and to generate more mental wellness among people.

Michael – If you are struggling. If you’re living with a problem that is affecting your ability to function at the way you would like to function, because you are anxious or depressed or having issues with substances for example, reach out for help. Tell somebody. Talk to somebody. You deserve it. You deserve to get better. You may not think you do, but you do. Nobody should be struggling and suffering in silence.

Michael – We need to normalize the discussion. We need to continue to talk about these issues and raise the awareness of these issues, so that more people will feel safer and realize that they can reach out to somebody.

Michael – Without hope I was lost when I was not feeling well. Before I had my moment on the balcony I was hopeless. I was clueless as to how I would ever get better. But once I had the moment and that sliver of light broke through the darkness, I had the first stirrings of hope.  Having hope propelled me forward. Having hope motivated me. Having hope gave me the ability to go seek out the help I needed. It gave me the motivation to start doing things for myself that would help me improve both physically and mentally.

Bulletin Board Quote brought to you by John: As soon as they say it, that’s a bad sign.

Guest Information: Michael Herman is a lawyer with and General Counsel to Canadian offices of international law firm Gowling WLG. As General Counsel, Michael provides legal advice to the law firm, and plays many important roles within Gowling WLG. With more than 30 years of experience, he’s is also highly regarded as a strategic adviser to a broad range of clients. For example, he advises clients on mergers and acquisitions, corporate development, corporate finance and other complex business matters. Michael spent a number of years in senior executive positions at multi-national public corporations, where he was responsible for strategic planning, strategic partnerships, corporate governance and other marketing and investor relations activities.

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Thanks for joining us,
(-(-_(-_-)_-)-)   Your wellness check-in team
John, Sammy, Cameron, Sheila and Julie

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E009 Michael Herman Mental Illness Self-stigma 1