E073 Shereen Samuels “Woke”: Something Changed

Let’s Be Well Together Podcast - Episode 73
Date: June 20, 20223

Participants: John Webster, Elise Seifert, Cameron Earnshaw and Sheila Webster
Guest: Shereen Samuels (interview) and Laurie Flanagan (Move That Body)

Start times and Segments:

[0:00:35] What’s On Your Mind: A social media post illustrating signs of burn out. Some were surprising. If we recognize them in ourselves, we can introspect and figure out whether we feel burned out.

[0:10:22] Expanding Minds Interview: [Social Wellness] We interview Shereen Samuels in the area of Social Wellness.⁠ An article sparked discussion: “Of Course You Know What ‘Woke’ Means”, by Freddie DeBoer. It got us thinking, then concluding that something has changed. It feels like a moment in history of generational shift. Some people imbue “woke” with absolute fury, but if you ask why then it’s not clear. There are many differences in the way Millennials and Gen Zs grew up believing how the world works, compared to Baby Boomers and Gen Xers. With new generations there’s also a next level sophistication about how they judge what and how things are done. The word “woke” is being used as a way to shut down conversations. It’s being used by people who don’t want to think about what might lie underneath “woke”. It’s frustrating, because it’s a word that has such meaning to the black community. To have it co-opted in that way is painful.

[0:27:37] Adventures of the Starving Artist: Cameron got a dose of small world syndrome, with several coincidences happening at the same event.

[0:32:10] Move That Body: Laurie Flanagan is getting into Pilates. She’s having lots of fun and getting great workouts.

[0:36:55] Running Popup: John loves music and how much it helps him. On this occasion, it swept frustration away.

[0:39:55]  Flipside of the Coin: A meme hit home: I’m stuck between “I need to save money” and “You only live once”. It’s so true in life.

Quotes and Take-Aways:

Elise – I think the pandemic helped me to realize that when I’m feeling sick, it’s okay to take a day for myself to help myself to heal, and how much better I’ll perform after taking that one day rather than 5 or 6 days where I feel at 80% rather than 100%. People feel that they don’t have the time to take care of themselves, but they do and they should.

John – That’s one of the themes I’m trying to communicate in this show: Try and learn more about yourself. Introspect. The more we read about symptoms, wellness, etc., the more factors we can consider when we introspect to try to find what’s affecting us. It takes work, but it’s worth it.

Shereen – I think there are a lot of people feeling right now that something has changed. I think that the something that’s changed is that we are in a moment of generational shift.

Shereen – Some folks feel as though the world is passing them by, or the way they understand the world to work is suddenly turned on its head. That at its heart is where the absolute fury comes from, when I hear people imbuing the word “woke” with it. People are angry, but if you try to press to understand what they’re angry about, then it’s not very clear.

Shereen – Millennials and Gen Zs are set to overtake voting power from Baby Boom ers soon. They grew up with the Chart of Rights in Canada. There are many differences in how they grew up believing the world works, compared to how Baby Boomers and Gen X’ers grew up believing the world works. That’s the crux of what we’re experiencing.

Shereen – What I see at the workplace is not only that shift in thinking about the bare minimum standard we should expect on things like freedoms, tolerance, rights and equity. It’s not just where Millennials and Gen Zs think that minimum standard sit, in a completely different place than it has for the last 25 years, but they also have a next level sophistication about how they will judge what you are doing and how you are doing it.

Shereen – In history, the use of “woke” came from the Jim Crow era in the U.S. and part of African American dialect. It was a way of people saying to each other, “You as an individual are having a hard time. Remember that it’s not just you. Remember that there are whole structures in place here and remember to stay awake. Remember to see that for what it is and not just lose yourself in despair.”

Shereen – A new generation of black people are calling back to the language of their fathers and grandfathers and their mother and grandmothers and saying, “stay woke”, because it had cultural significance. It is saying the same thing. We’re decades away from that, but still stay alert to racial prejudice. Stay alert to how it’s showing up in our lives now, because it’s showing up differently than it did in our ancestors’ lives, but it’s still showing up and we must stay awake. We must be working together to fight it.

Shereen – The word “woke” is being used as a way to shut down conversations. It’s being used by people who don’t want to think about what might lie underneath “woke”. We talked about the difference between not racist and antiracist in our last discussion. It’s a move towards thinking about the experience of discrimination as being built into structures. The minute you start talking in that way, people will use the word “woke” to shut down the conversation. It feels to me almost out of fear and not wanting to hear it. It’s frustrating because it’s a word that has such meaning to the black community. To have it co-opted in that way is painful.

Shereen – For the last 20-25 years we’ve had a slow breakdown in our trust in evidence-based conversation. This is one of the most pernicious things about the desire to label people, which is happening on the left and the right. The way we get back to discourse is having some sort of trust in evidence.

Shereen – The article talks about emotionality as a hallmark of wokenesss. That is not my experience. Those of us working in the field work very hard to use evidence wherever we can, to show what we are saying has a reality, because we do get dismissed. We get dismissed out of hand if we can’t make the case in some way out of our own heads.

Shereen – I hope we’re not living in a post-facts world. I hope we’re just living in a post-facts phase that is going to end.

Bulletin Board Quote brought to you by Sheila: I related to this so well. It’s actually Kermit the frog.

Guest Information: Shereen Samuels has over 23 years of experience in DEI workplace initiatives, including change work, curriculum development, and group process facilitation. She’s worked on leadership, policy development, strategic planning, communications, board governance, and risk management. She has extensive experience in senior management and academic research. Shereen identifies as a Black, queer, first-generation immigrant ciswoman of South African heritage. She is the creator of the Meaningful Inclusion Matrix, a framework to guide organizations in becoming more inclusive.

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Thanks for joining us,
(-(-_(-_-)_-)-)   Your wellness check-in team
John, Sammy, Cameron, Sheila, Elise, Isabelle and Julie